At the same time, in Austin’s Koreatown, a group of Koreans rushed into Austin Karaoke. The karaoke bar is owned by a Korean, and it is not difficult to find the Korean liquor soju there.
“There are few foreigner customers, most customers are Korean directly from Korea,” said Josh Lee, working at the karaoke bar.
We've had this conversation before:
August 11, 2009: "So were they American or Armenian?"
January 28, 2009: "Us versus them: More about 외국인."
It could be just a case of not knowing how to handle the word "외국인" in English, but then again Koreans do refer to non-Koreans as 외국인 in their native countries. This letter was written by a Korean studying at the University of Texas at Austin, and talks about the differences between American and Korean drinking culture. Being a student adds another layer to this, because I don't think it's uncommon to hear of Korean students hanging out exclusively with other Koreans when studying abroad.
There are several big differences between Koreans and Americans in terms of drinking. First, Korean culture is more closed than American. In other words Koreans usually hang out with only Koreans.
Here's a quotation from a student in Wisconsin:
“When we hang out with people from other countries, they don’t really speak formally, even in English, therefore I can hardly accept their different attitude from a Korean perspective."
I can appreciate how hard it is to make friends with people in a foreign country, though the difficulties are increased---whether as a foreign English teacher in Korea, or as a Korean student in the United States---when you hang out in segregated crowds. But when you've studied English for a decade and are still complaining about how English-speakers relate to each other, or when you have the opportunity to study at one of the better public universities in the nation and talk about "I can hardly accept," it's clear where the hang-up lies. I fully grant, though, that like in any article in an English-language publication in Korea, the quotations here could be fabricated, poorly translated, or partially remembered, but that doesn't change that they've appeared in print.
On that topic I recall a dissertation written by a Korean student at my old university that I wrote about in a February post. Titled Extra consciousness : role of anxiety in the self-concepts of South Korean students in the U.S. from a cultural perspective, it included quotations from other Korean students about their experiences in the US:
After some meetings she cried at the native speaker students' unfavorable attitude to her because
"In Malay, they are Asian, but in here, there are Whites, Blacks...I am just shrinking. In small community, Asian is not many, so Americans watch me, which makes me feeling bad. I wonder why they are watching me. I am daunted of myself."
. . .
As another unique point she tried to understand her 'unkind' native speaking American people. She made an effort to find similarity between their negative attitudes toward her and her experience in South Korea about other foreigners: "I looked at foreigners in Korea, too... There must be some parts that I misunderstood... I find that first; I must participate in their communication by myself. At first, I wanted them approaching to me. I thought they hesitated in approaching to me because of me, Asian. But I find that Americans are unnatural to meet new person. So, I think that I need to start talking and approach to them first."
. . .
If I go back to Korea, I might not come back again to America. America is like a fantastic amusement park, which seems interesting when seeing that from outside, but actually, entering inside of that, finally I found that there are few things that I can enjoy. Outside is pretty, inside is nothing, different from my expectation."
. . .
There is a limitation in relationships with American classmates. They have no Heart...I don't have any expectations of my American classmates. I prefer Internationals from the same Asian cultural background...It's not comfortable to Be around with Americans. They are too proud, and arrogant. Their smile and Kindness to strangers is good, but theirs are superficial.
Well, not surprising that they had a shitty time in rural Pennsylvania with such attitudes. I noticed in that dissertation and in many other sources I read that Koreans' anxiety abroad is often examined vis-a-vis English, and that the people they meet are looked at as simply native speakers, rather than complete people. I'm not going to base my whole thesis on a few people I've bumped into, but I recall reading a student's application for a study abroad program to Ohio, and his whole reason for going, and for getting an opportunity to spend a year in an American high school, was to improve his English, and he said so in just about every open-ended question on the application. It seems politically incorrect to suggest there are cultural factors that make it harder for a group to adapt to a new country or to a new language, and indeed the stuff I read in preparation for coming to Korea years ago didn't touch on that, but I think it's certainly worth exploring how Koreans' views on quote-unquote foreigners condition their experiences abroad.
On a different note, I'll close with this quotation from that student's letter:
“This is our way to drink and have fun at this party. Let’s chug!” said Kevin Schlosser, a 21-year-old sophomore, totally intoxicated.
That quotation has to be fabricated, and if that's how Korean students are learning how to speak at parties in Texas, it's no wonder they're hanging out by themselves.
40 comments:
Loled a the "They are too proud, and arrogant. Their smile and Kindness to strangers is good, but theirs are superficial." line.
Well Koreans also do say some candid things that would make people run for the hills after they know them for a while. 2 Korean guys I knew in America would often speak their displeasure towards "Black Man style."
I sat through a slide show one time by a Korean guy who lived in Oregon for a while. He complained that a difference between American and Korean culture was that his American freinds didn't reply to his emails and one guy even ignored him face to face on the street. This was all after he invited them to his house for dinner. My guess is that these people were hardly freinds but mere classmates and he probably made some racial faux pas or faux pas about someone's that made the other people uncomfortable, therefore they ignored him.
But also think of the terms by which Koreans make freinds. I think there is a certain expectation by Koreans that younger people respect them, and in this respect English doesn't cater to Koreans well. Picture this situation: there is a 26 year old Korean guy, he had been in the army for 2 years and is attending an American university as a sophmore. he is in a class with a 24 year old American guy who wants to be the Korean's freind, and the American is a senior. The Korean doesn't ever say his real name and gets upset whenever younger people say "Hey you." The 24 year old American guy just says "whatever" an leaves the Korean guy alone.
Also the lack of P.C. bangs could make things difficult.
Last quote is definitely fake. Who (among native speakers) has ever said "Let's chug"?
Regarding the difficulty of fitting in as a foreign student, just yesterday I had a lengthy discussion with "M," a student at my university here in Hawaii.
"M" is a nice person, tries to make an effort to meet people and follow conversations, but does have a little difficulty expressing herself.
She finds herself having great difficulty making friends in her regular classes. She doesn't make awkward racial faux-pas, she isn't weird, there's nothing wrong with her, but she still has difficulty. I wonder if part of the problem lies with (many) American students unwilling to make an effort with foreign students or not knowing how to.
Most of the foreign students I know here end up having good relationships with their TAs (in fact, that's how I got to be friends with some of them), because the TA is sort of a captive audience long enough to develop a more in-depth interpersonal relationship with them.
It also gave me insight into a phenomenon I'd recognized long at UCI: Japanese and Korean students often becoming close friends. Each other provides a chance to get to know someone free of the burden of intra-cultural hierarchy and what not that many people wanted to leave behind in Korea or Japan, but close enough culturally to have a lot in common.
"M," who is Japanese, is finding out that same kind of thing. Most of her friends are Korean, Japanese, or Taiwanese students here. The Americans she's friends with (or at least acquaintances) are not her classmates but her dorm neighbors.
In Korea (and I guess Japan), it could be the opposite, since there is a desire to practice English by at least a sizable portion of the population. There is a smaller number among them who really want to get to know the person for who he/she is, but I guess that dehumanization of the foreign resident as an "other" among many English enthusiasts is the Korean counterpart to the American student in the US who doesn't know how to deal with the student from a place he/she isn't all that interested in.
Yeah Kushibo, Americans can just be dicks too.
"M" probably gets tired of the same questions that English teachers get tired of answering. For Koreans it is probably worse. For example:
"So like are you from the good Korea or the bad Korea?"
"Do you guys like have cars there?"
Understanding English when in a library were an American student is talking too loudly into their cellphone probably wouldn't encourage freindship either:
"Dude I got the blood test back yesterday, looks like a can't go camping this weekend I'm kind of bummed."
3gyupsal, though "M" is Japanese (not Korean), I know that on the Mainland South Korean students often get those questions. Even returning English teachers get those questions!
Anyway, my message wasn't exactly that Americans can be dicks (some are, but most aren't, I think), but just that even when the foreign student/resident isn't doing anything wrong, they still might get this unsatisfactory outcome.
I once taught a university student at a hogwon in Seoul who came into class one day with the shocking news that his cousin had been shot. It turned out that the cousin was in a car on a Los Angeles freeway with a few other Koreans in the car. He was in the passenger seat and he looked out the window and saw a car with 4 young black men inside. He pointed at the car and told his friends to look at the black guys (he was probably laughing or smiling as he did it). That didnt go over well and one of the black guys began shooting at the car. The cousin took a bullit to the shoulder. "Why did they shoot him?!" I didn't answer the question as he would have had no idea what I was talking about. So the cousin got shot, but probably didnt learn a lesson. The Koreans in the car probably concluded that it was a hate crime or a random act of violence rather than Korean stupidity. Not to stand up for the black guys, but anyone from the States knows that it is not a good idea to point at black men (and probably laugh).
1994 wrote:
He pointed at the car and told his friends to look at the black guys (he was probably laughing or smiling as he did it). That didnt go over well and one of the black guys began shooting at the car.
If this story is true, and people in the car would be set off so badly by someone looking at them or pointing at them that they would shoot at them, it's a pretty good bet that they were looking for an excuse to shoot at someone and the Korean cousin inadvertently gave that to them.
In SoCal, I've been shot at (for going to slow in the slow lane while preparing to exit) and my father was once chased for twenty miles (my little brother and I were in the car at the time) when he inadvertently cut someone off.
These were not people who were just normal, upstanding folks, suddenly triggered by an egregious event; they were looking for trouble, evidenced by the weapons they happened to have at the ready in the car.
BTW, though I spent part of my youth in Compton, both aforementioned cases were in Orange County, along the 91 or 57 freeways.
I've gotten the impression that most Korean students who move abroad to study English don't even consider the fact that they will be immersing themselves in the culture, not just the language. This is probably because most of them have little personal interest in English-speaking cultures; they want to study English simply because they believe that's what successful Koreans do. So it makes sense that some of them would find the cultural differences frustrating and overwhelming, subsequently spending all their time with other Koreans, and, ironically, speaking only Korean most of the time.
Of course, here we're only hearing from students who aren't adjusting well -- I would imagine there's plenty of Korean students abroad who have a more positive, or at least more balanced, view of the cultural differences. Hell, the students quoted could simply have been caught on a bad day. I certainly had bad days in Korea when I felt like living there was not worth the cultural differences I had to put up with, but that's not how I felt most of the time, or how I feel now, looking back on my time in Korea.
Peter, at my university South Koreans are the second largest group (only after Japanese students... a situation similar to what you find with numbers in California), and I would say that your description does not describe the typical South Korean student here (undergrad or grad).
It may, however, be a different story with language students, but even those are trying to get something out of the culture they're in.
I'd also like to say that it's partly the failure of the school if the students don't integrate to some degree. I was just discussing homestays this afternoon with someone, and there are some who get involved with homestays so that they can rent out that add-on they've built for this purpose. Not at all a form of integration or cultural connection.
Of course, the counterpart to that is the English speaker in a homestay where the parents think it's a way to get an English teacher on the cheap (which I'm sure is not uncommon).
@Kushi,
I had no reason to doubt the veracity of his story. But I dont think you can paint L.A. gangbangers as not normal or people who drive in L.A. with guns in the car as not normal. I knew some gangbangers in Oakland and San Francisco and they were normal guys caught up in urban life.
Asian exchange students from China, Taiwan, and Korean find it hard to blend into American society and college life especially. There was a Taiwanese kid in my poetry class at university. Fresh off the boat. We were required to read poems that we had writen in front of the class. Now this is San Francisco. The teacher was an open lesbian and had written a book of lesbian-related poetry that was published. This kid was so oblivious to the teacher's sexual orientation and also couldnt notice the openly gay couple in the room and others.
He read his poem which was something like this:
"I dont want to talk to the gay,
I dont want to be like the gay,
I dont want to see the gay..."
He finished his poem and the teacher said, "Who's first (to comment on his poem)?"
Hands up all around the class. Needless to say, he got a rough awakening in class that day.
there are difficulties and faults on both sides of this issue, and certainly too many of them to count. there is certainly some blame to be had among american students, to the extent that they have any responsibility in the matter. i would guess that most college students, and undergrads especially, don't generally go out of their way to get to know exchange students. and not because they're rude bastards, but just because most of them have little motivation. in korea, foreigners are still a novelty, and koreans engage them for a myriad of reasons, some genuine, some not. but in the states, or most other countries, that's not at the case. like in all cultures, people generally fall into a group of others with similar interests. and not because we dislike those who are different, but because it's easier and more comfortable to associate with people who have the same tastes, sense of humor, etc. etc. and many of us rarely step outside of that unless presented with a bona fide reason to do so. and that's within a single culture (albeit one much less uniform than korean or several mother cultures). when you start talking about two people from completely separate cultures, i would guess they rarely make any kind of deep or lasting connection unless both parties have a very good reason to do so. growing up, through middle, high, school, university, there were always plenty foreign-born students around, and i can't really think of any that i rose above being casual acquaintances with. it wasn't because i disliked them. i simply, for whatever reason, never really recognized what the benefit would be of trying twice as hard to relate to someone. granted, i've never been a terribly outgoing person, and that brings up another issue, being that it depends on awful lot on the personality of the person. if we're talking about someone who is comfortable, outgoing, friendly, likable in their own culture, then i would guess they would have few problems fitting in and making the cultural adjustments necessary to thrive in another. anyone who doesn't fit that description is going to have greater difficulty.
'other cultures' not 'mother cultures'.
1994, riding around in cars with guns is more common than you think. I'm from Michigan where we have Rednecks, hunters, African Americans, and a few Latinos. My white uncle accidentally shot somebody with his AK 47 back in the nineties, I think the other person survived, that's why he's not in jail. I used to work in a factory with Mexican guy who liked to talk about his AK, and said that if the government wanted to take it away, he'd take some of the g-men with him. The point is, is that it is probably not a good idea to point an laugh at anybody anywhere in America because you never know who is packing heat.
I think in general there are areas of politness that don't really match between the states and Korea. For example an older woman at the bank is more likely to cut you in line here, but nobody says anything out of politeness. Where in The States, the impolite act of cutting in line warrents a severe tounge lashing, that would be unheard of in Korea if you are younger than the offender.
Sorry. I don't mean to hijack the thread, and I realize that I'm getting further and further away from Brian's original point, but I find this discussion interesting.
And please don't take anything I say with offense, because I don't mean anything negative about anyone here.
1994 wrote:
I had no reason to doubt the veracity of his story.
Sorry. I didn't mean that you were lying, only that stories can get somewhat embellished each time they're retold, a point that I think was underscored in that you were speculating about whether they were laughing at the Black guys in the car.
But I dont think you can paint L.A. gangbangers as not normal or people who drive in L.A. with guns in the car as not normal. I knew some gangbangers in Oakland and San Francisco and they were normal guys caught up in urban life.
Yes, this is true. Having grown up in a predominantly Black neighborhood left desolate after a bout of White flight left the tax base a shambles, I know this all too well.
But that doesn't negate my point that — irrespective of the Korean students' behavior — these "normal" people were probably itching for a confrontation, and they probably would have found it regardless of the Korean students' behavior.
"What you lookin' at?" is enough.
Asian exchange students from China, Taiwan, and Korean find it hard to blend into American society and college life especially.
I'd have to add Japanese students to that list. And pretty much anyone from East Asia. Maybe Africa, too. And the Muslim students. (I live in an international dorm and I hear a lot of stuff.)
Frankly, the reaction-to-gays story is mostly a reflection of a lack of prior awareness of the public face of tolerance that is ingrained in American society today.
Lots of Koreans (and Taiwanese) are much more neutral or even curious about homosexuality, but there are still a bunch who are not.
Anyway, how would he, a Taiwanese, be expected to know the cues of an American lesbian's sexual orientation? I hope your class didn't turn a learning moment into a pile-on or a witch hunt.
andrew, I agree with you about American students not going out of their way to get to know exchange students or international students (a different group, the latter being regular students at the university) because of a perceived lack of interests.
The international students here get attention mostly from, seriously, guys on the prowl who have learned that if, for example, they join the international clubs or sign up to be mentors, they stand a good chance of getting laid by the end of the semester, if they knew how to pick the easy targets out of the group. (Sorry, but I knew some of these people and their attitudes were pretty scummy.)
Aside from that, I don't really want to lay blame with anybody. It's a set of circumstances, not malicious intent, that is leading us to this. My whole point in the first place was that I think it's often counterproductive to look at a lonely international student and try to find what pathology he/she has.
This is very interesting stuff. I'd like to add that Koreans (and I guess other foreigners) who exclude themselves from the rest of American society tend to have negative experiences, but the Koreans I know who made an effort to hang out with Americans and learn about American culture had many positive things to say.
I guess you if go to a foreign country with with pre-conceived notions and an unwillingness to change your views, its not surprising if you don't have a good time.
The most amusing thing about Koreans in the US is how they perceive other foreigners from "poor" countries. Its funny to observe people from a less developed country with poor English make fun of other people for being from a less developed country with poor English.
Earlier today I was with my family at a coffee shop in the Islands when two, then four more Koreans arrived. They are all here to study English; it was obvious from their materials.
In the past, I would've said hi and given them a chance to talk with a native speaker while possibly making new friends. Now that I am familiar with Korean culture, not only I did I say nothing, I didn't even look at them more than once. I now know that actually USING English with a stranger outside a class for which they have paid is just about the last thing on Earth they want to do.
Strange people. Strange culture.
Weiku Boy, you're on the islands? Which island? Oahu, Manhattan, or Vancouver?
I don't think most American students can see whether or not someone is a student from another country or merely just an asian-american. There's no reason to assume either in certain places. At UH Hilo there's tons of students in each category, and unless you know for sure they're an international student, there's no reason to just go and bother them while they're waiting for their day to finish so they can drive home. Assuming all asian students are from another country will probably get you in more trouble than you want, at least in Hilo.
@Kushi,
"I hope your class didn't turn a learning moment into a pile-on or a witch hunt."
His learning moment was the pile on. He got...oh how should I say it...a cultural bukkake. Everyone was civil enough as this was a classroom setting, but we laid into him hard. I reread his poem subsituting 'Chinese' for 'gay.' The gay couple sitting next to him clowned him and then were flirtatious with him the rest of the semester, much to his displeasure.
Look at North American students who come to study at Yonsei for a summer or a semester. They immerse themselves in all things Korean. I sublet my aprtment to a kid who went to the Yonsei summer program. He had a kickass time and learned everything he possibly could about Korea. He loves the place and wants to sublet the place in winter.
Maybe this is a gender problem. I have dated a number of Korean women who simply loved the USA. I think if they are really into white guys and go to the US, they have a good experience. Sexy Korean girls in the US for studying? Yah...there are popular.
Even if the Koreans in 1994's first example were acting like fools staring at the Aprika people, I don't think you can really call shooting up a car a proper response. Perhaps that is the response you'll get in LA or other gun-loving places, but those Koreans will return home and perpetuate the stereotype---right in some cases---of the dangerous American city. Turns out that young black men in LA gangs don't make a good welcoming committee.
I think it's true that we don't really pay much attention to foreign students here, or even to foreigners (unless they're doing something bad or taking our jobs). I had met some Koreans through work before I completed college, and I tried to help them as much as possible by talking to them, giving them rides, showing them stuff around town. And in school I joined an international exchange program and got to spend time with people from Korea and Taiwan. But now, after seeing how hard it can be to be a foreigner, and seeing how frustrating it can be to live in the US, I feel bad for not trying to do a lot more.
But old o brings up a good point. Going up to foreign-looking people in the US and trying to be friendly or helpful has a good chance of going wrong. Maybe they're not foreign after all. Or maybe they're suspicious of Americans. Or maybe they're actually grad students in the university's neurobotany department, or something, and don't need your help. Or maybe they're proud and don't want "help." Could be a number of things.
Weiku Boy, you're on the islands? Which island? Oahu, Manhattan, or Vancouver?
The Islands that are four hours due south of the ROK. Where Koreans stand out like sore thumbs, and aren't much liked -- not that they would ever notice or care.
@Kushibo
Just to clarify (I was pretty sleepy when I wrote my initial comment), I only meant to comment on Korean students whose primary motivation for studying abroad is to improve their English. I would imagine students who study abroad for other reasons would tend to have a very different attitude. And you're right, from what I've heard, some "homestay parents" in the US and Canada have no interest in cultural exchange either, and see only dollar signs. I'm sure there are plenty of systemic problems that do make Korean students' experience abroad more difficult. But no matter what, if you visit a foreign country without an open mind (as some, not all, of these students do), you're definitely going to have a crappy time. It's as true for Korean students abroad as it is for the bitter, obnoxious NSETs in Korea who make the more open-minded NSETs look bad.
Peter, I took it the way you meant. Although I would also say that — at least in my experience — the English language students who come over are not uniform either in terms of being uninterested in learning the culture and meeting the people.
Though perhaps least equipped to go out and interact extensively with the locals, many are enthusiastic to do so. Or at least start out that way.
Brian, I agree with everything you wrote, especially that gangs don't make good welcoming committees, which reminded me of this post from last year.
WeikuBoy, too bad. It would have been fun to have a coffee or beer. Maybe even drive you and your family out to one of our low-cost or no-cost tourist attractions that make up for the astronomic hotel prices.
WeikuBoy wrote:
Where Koreans stand out like sore thumbs, and aren't much liked -- not that they would ever notice or care.
Do any of these locals you mention earn money off Koreans they loathe?
"Do any of these locals you mention earn money off Koreans they loathe?"
Ah, the Ugly Korean argument. No, the fact is, they don't. Koreans stay in Korean-owned hotels, eat at Korean-owned restaurants, and spend money only at Korean-owned language schools and tourist sites. Hence their unpopularity.
In fact, I'm going to double-check the coffee shop with the wireless internet access we were at today. Good internet access is hard to come by in The Islands; but if the shop is Korean owned, we'll go elsewhere from now on.
Weiku Boy wrote:
Ah, the Ugly Korean argument.
I wasn't making an argument at all. That was a genuine question, which you answered just fine, thanks.
I have a particular dislike of people making money off of people they loathe, whether they be a Black-hating liquor store owner in Los Angeles County's poorer neighborhoods, a tourist-hating local who willingly earns a living off them, or an English teacher who generally despises the people in the country where he/she works.
Oh, and your unpopular-because-they-don't-spread-around-the-economic-wealth-or-opportunity scenario reminds me of criticisms of many Korean-owned businesses in South Central L.A. back in the 1990s.
I would hope you all realise that the criticisms commonly made against Koreans (they don't want to integrate, they only speak to other Koreans, they don't understand US 'culture', they only spend money at Korean establishments rather than 'genuine' bars and restaurants, etc) are the exact same criticisms that are made of native speaker English teachers when they come to Korea. I know that the two groups go to each respective country with different intentions, but in neither case are those intentions pure and unadulterated. I am sure that there are many 'foreigners' who have arrived in Korea with every intention of immersing themselves in Korean life only to change their mind as soon as they see what it's really like.
Of course, it doesn't help that both Korean and US culture are pretty severely fucked up and bizarre in their own way.
"I have a particular dislike of people making money off of people they loathe ..."
Then you must particularly dislike the Koreans, who have enriched themselves at the expense of the Americans through one-way trade.
Steve Bee makes a great point about the criticisms being similar from foreigners studying abroad and non-Koreans in Korea. It has always been my contention that no matter how long you've been in Korea, Koreans will always treat you as if you know nothing about Korea, its culture, customs, people...all things Korean.
I went to lunch with a late 30s Korean gentleman who works at a similar company in the building next to mine. He asked me how long I have been in Korea and I told him about 12 years, not consecutive. "Wow, that's a long time." Then the side dishes were brought to the table and he began naming them, including kimchi. I wanted desperately to run away.
Spoke to a Korean woman last week and she asked how long I have een in Korea. I replyied my former answer and she replied the Korean line, "Wow, that's a long time. Can you speak Korean? A little?"
Lady, I would have to be retarded not to be able to speak Korean after 12 years in your country.
They all have the same idea about us. Long hair=English teacher. Short hair=soldier. We dont like spicy food. We cant speak Korean. The men chace women at Hongdae.
When I worked to SMOE as an English teacher, my school pimped me out to another school in town for Summer English Camp. The co-teacher and I became friendly. She told me that the week before camp, some SMOE automatons came to review the school's (shoddy) plans for the summer camp. One of the officials, when asked about me, replied that I was a drinker who liked to meet women in clubs in Hongdae. I have not been to Hongdae at night since 2002. He didnt even know me.
Back to the original thread (and not to add gas to any fires)...
I went to a small liberal arts college with very few FES's. Most of them were European and had spoke English all their lives. Some were cool (went to parties, played in X-box challenges in the lounge, joined clubs and greek groups). Others were lame as hell and didn't involve themselves in "college life."
You know what though? There were loads of other lame people at my school and they were all born and raised in the US.
College is for education. Many people "find themselves" in college. Many Americans/Canadians/Brits/Ausies/Kiwis (maybe South Africans but I don't know too many) tend to go a bit nuts at college. We drink a lot, play a lot, study when we can. We make a lot of friends and lose a lot of friends. It's sort of like high school with better vocabulary and more alcohol.
There were few times in my life when I went out of my way to make friends with someone who was shy, demure, boring, lame, etc. Not because I'm a jerk. Because I would rather spend my time making friends with people like me: outgoing and energetic.
Whether because of a language "barrier" or personality, some foreign students probably thought the US was a crazy place filled with jerks.
Then again, maybe those people made really good friends with the other kids who prefered to go bowling than to a party, preferred to play warcraft than to play in the sand volleyball tourny, preferred to study quietly than to use the library as a social hub.
Nothing wrong with any of that. Just don't blame a country or it's citizens for your own inability to make friends and adapt to a new situation.
By "one-way trade" you mean "up," right?
Although bilateral trade between Korea and the United States grew tremendously in size, until 1981 the bilateral trade balance was persistently—with the exception of 1978—in favor of the United States. It shifted into Korea’s favor beginning in 1982 and has since grown significantly, reaching a peak at $8.96 billion in 2002. Korea showed a trade deficit with the United States in 1991 and 1992 and also from 1994 until 1997, but has maintained a surplus since the economic crisis of 1997. (source)
In 2002, the last figure given for stats, the US accounted for 15.1% of total ROK imports, while the ROK accounted for 3.05% of total US imports.
I've had a lot of experience with Korean students abroad, and I've also been a foreign student studying in Korea.
I was going to write a comment on here of some of my thoughts on the subject, but it ended up being too long, so I've expanded it into a post.
I think one thing that really affects this attitude is how homogenous a society Korea is. They don't have the diversity in race and culture in SK, so when they come to America they're just shocked and maybe uncomfortable, esp if they're the only Asian guy within a 5 mile radius.
God those are some close-minded comments though.
"By 'one-way trade' you mean "up," right?"
No, by "one-way trade" (as your own imbalanced numbers show) I mean Korea's long-standing practice of exporting high-end manufactured products to the U.S. while excluding such products from the U.S. Which is why, at a time when Korean auto sales in the U.S. are rising, I can count on the fingers of one hand the amount of American cars, computers, etc., I saw during two years in Korea.
Korean imports are a smaller part of the U.S. economy than imports from America are to Korea's economy? No surprise there. The U.S. economy is much bigger. But that has nothing to do with my point about one-way trade.
Kushibo, once in a while you make a good point, but for the most part you are a bore. And the more you try to defend Korea from the indefensible (bad public manners, ignorance and fear of the outside world, one-way trade) the more you make me (who am otherwise inclined to be a friend of Korea) want to attack it.
You make some valid points, WeikuBoy, but if I were to answer them, it would be totally off-topic. And if I gave a proper answer to your ad hominem attack, I'd be way off topic.
I'll just end by saying that I do in fact have lots of constructively critical things to say about things and people in Korea, some of them extremely critical. But don't mistake my unwillingness to suffer Korea-bashing and uninformed criticism as cheerleading. It's not.
This post takes me back to my own days as a foreign student in China. I spent a year at a major university in Beijing in the mid-90s. Our classes were not integrated with those of the Chinese students so it was pretty difficult to meet them (although it was easy to find people wanting to use you for english practice). However, within the foreign student community there were definite cliques. The Koreans definitely tended to hang out only with each other (to the distress of the male foreign students). The Japanese socialised quite well for the most part. The Africans hung out together (although they tended to be somewhat older than the rest of us) and the poor North Korean student seemed to spend most of his time alone.
At the end of that year what had I learnt? That Japanese are pretty shy but friendly once you crack the surface, that Koreans are standoffish and arrogant, that chinese are mercenary and that it's difficult to find anything in common with someone from Gabon. Are these geralisations? Hell yes, I fully accept that you can't tar everyone with the same brush, but they reflect my experience and they give me a frame of reference for dealing with such people in the future.
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